Okay, so there's probably a few microsoft shops who are early adopters. it's probably used on the odd bespoke web app used inside a company. but given how pervasive flash is, why use it on a web site?

Surely an Open Source version of C# ought naturally to be called D Flat?

By the same argument you may as well say,

"everyone uses windows 3.1, why bother with this new linux thing."

"everyone uses IE, why bother with Firefox"

"everyone uses 123, why use Excel"

"everyone video edits on Avid, why use Premier"

etc.

etc.

ITV are using it for some stuff, 2008 olympics used it, think there might be some other big-ish names, but not many

trust those fuckups at itv to use this needless piece of crap and piss off its viewers just that little bit more

Miguel de Icaza out of our free software club?

He is the worst thing to happen to open source software ever!

Google doomed both Silverlight and Flash as soon as they released Chrome. The browser sucks, but there is no question that it will start a compiled-javascript arms race that will force other browsers to implement similar schemes, making Javascript the de-facto language for delivering RIAs (sorry, stupid buzzword, I meant "web-apps based largely on client-side functionality). HTML 5, SVG, Javascript, and AJAX will win this for sure.

As this heap of stinking dog poo requires Mono.

And as that is most likely got lots of patent violation in it and is the Trijan Horse that Microsoft want to sink Linux.

Any site I find that uses it gets :-

1) Put on my personal blacklist

2) I send a polite email stating that they may well have lost a sale because of their adoption of this pile of dog poo.

But as I use a 64bit O/S, I don't have much success with all those sites that are totally created in Flash.

Black Helicopter because it can be use to spread the Plague....

I admire Miguel's stance. At least he's open minded and reaches out. He see's the good in the MS behemoth.

If he fails; a bunch of trolls can feel good about themselves, maybe some lame patent infringements get served, and worst case, Miguel could move on to a new OSS crusade if he wished.

If he succeeds; he scores a potentially major slice of mindshare for the OSS team. Heck, maybe MS will even learn you don't have to be an insular bully. Seems worth the risk... ?

Why is there silverlight and moonlight? Why not just moon light?

If MS was serious about taking on flash - they would have a single open source totally patent free / agreement not to sue - that way it makes it a decent alternative to flash. But then MS cannot move in with Embrace , Extend , Extinguish. But no, MS are only intent on total market domination.

They are silly , moves like this threaten the internet as a whole. Instead of lots of just about compatible sites - you have some work with this , some work with that. Making joe sixpack, linda the hockey mom and sarah p the stupid - not understand the internet and stop using it.

Ahhhh. The penny drops.

It's not just Microsoft who "embrace and extend".

It's actually just an irresistable thing for *developers* to do.

This explains why I can't compile most FOSS C/C++ code on any other compiler than gcc.

1. Miguel de Icaza is one of the originators and lead developers of the Gnome desktop, so calling him "...the worst thing to happen to open source software ever" is a patent absurdity. This guy operates at a much higher level than you may realize.

2. I think Kevin Hoffman is really on to something when he predicts that Microsoft plans Silverlight as much, much more than a Flash wannabee. In fact, they may not even care if anyone uses it for workaday web development. What we may be looking at is the internal GUI tool for their next epoch: http://dotnetaddict.dotnetdevelopersjournal.com/silverlight2_important.htm

I'm no fan of MS (quite the opposite), but read the post - Kevin's vision seems penetrating.

It's time to stop following in the footsteps of Adobe and M$. Blaze our own path - Moonlight should be working the EEE magic.

"Miguel de Icaza is one of the originators and lead developers of the Gnome desktop, so calling him "...the worst thing to happen to open source software ever" is a patent absurdity."

It isn't a "patent absurdity" (which is quite a pun). What you are saying is in fact a fallacy, a leap in logic which requires the reader to ignore information about Icaza, his relationships with Microsoft and Novell, and his active participation in furthering goals which are very much part of Microsoft and Novell's agenda's. You left this kind of material out of the equation. Tell me something, if a man who was once a war hero turned around later and became a serial killer, would the "he's done great things for his country" argument help him in court ? Miguel isn't sometimes called "Anakin de Icaza" for no reason you know.

"This guy operates at a much higher level than you may realize."

No, he's not a divine being. He's the guy who gushes praise for all things Microsoft and has become their very useful little trojan whose machinations today are a danger to the future of that very GNOME project he once pioneered. If you think thats operating at some "higher level", good luck to you with that...

"I'm no fan of MS (quite the opposite)"

Oh no of course not... you're not a shill or an astroturfer... you just walk like a duck, talk like a duck and quack like a duck... Oh no, you're not a duck because you say, "I'm not a duck".

Jeremy,

You very well may have more/better info than me - I certainly don't follow all de Icaza's activities. What I meant by "higher level" was a (perhaps naive) intuition that his guiding philosophies are about encouraging interoperability on many levels and accruing power and ease of use - by any means necessary - for unix-like operating systems. My take on him was that he is immensely practical and not ideological. Of course, I could be wrong. My link to Hoffman's post was intended to ally fears; the way I see it, if MS wants to focus on Silverlight as the UI for their cloud apps and doesn't in fact care much about trying to beat Flash at its own game, then, in a sense, we can stop worrying about Silverlight! This because I see it getting restricted to their insular (and therefore doomed) attempt to capitalize on "the cloud."

Remember GCC back when it was just a C compiler and G++ was the C++ frontend? Remember some of its more egregios violations of C90 (nested functions being a particular favourite)? See, it's "E-E-E" when Microsoft do it, but when RMS does it it's a Good Thing.

PS: Jeremy, you're a cock. I know this because you "walk like a cock, talk like a cock and look like a cock..." Fun, this game, innit...