SproutCore seems to me to be Apple's answer to Google's Web Toolkit (GWT). Rather than using Ruby, it uses Java, but the results are the same - a set of HTML + Javascript files. GWT goes further with the ability to itegrate into back-end Java server code plus ful ability to debug prior to exporting to Javascript. Apple has some way to go in this toolkit arena, but it my view this is clearly an iPhone v Android web application battleground.

Seems like platform with potential. Accent on 'potential'. I have nothing more interesting to say except does anyone think developers outside of Apple would be interested?

Well, as excited as I am about SproutCore (it does look cool), coming from a newbie-cocoa programmer who hasn't done much Javascripting and hates touching HTML & CSS, I don't think SproutCore is the way to go here; it might of been 2 weeks ago.

That was before objective-j. You've probably seen the news on it; 3 college grads, two of whom recently did some work for Apple, wrote an entire implementation of the Cocoa-frameworks, or something very very very similar thereof, in javascript, and are vowing it'll be released OpenSource very soon. Apparently they just want to tie up some loose ends. The reason why "Cappuccino" (getit? A mix of Java and Cocoa; cute, I know), their Objective-J framework, is cooler than SproutCore is it doesn't use any Ruby at all, and allows developers to build rich-web interfaces, full programs even, and deploy them without ever seeing a single piece of HTML. It builds just like a desktop app, and thanks to their implementation of the Cocoa frameworks, you can even code-share between your Cocoa desktop app and your Cappuccino web app!! Even better yet, since it's a strict implementation of Javascript, you can still have access to all the underlying language features, just as in Cocoa you can still use the base-level C language (if you want).

Because of the way it's built it too requires no new downloads for end-users; if their browser supports Javascript, it'll run no problems. Apparently it even works in IE6!!

I think we can expect big things from these guys. If you've not seen or heard of it, there's a tech demo app they built for making powerpoint/keynote presentations in a web-browser! This web-app is better than many desktop apps and runs in about the time it takes to launch powerpoint. You simply cannot get any better!!!

Here's their blog: http://blog.280north.com/

And here's their tech-demo (which apparently isn't even finished yet!):

http://280slides.com/

Robert Rankin must be proud. Finally, someone in the big wide world pays homage to the man who invented Sproutlore, The Sprouts of Wrath and Sprout Mask Replica. And with Apple's backing too, a combination particularly rich in vitamins...

The lack of IE6 compatibility and use of Ruby over Java makes it an also-ran in my book, but each to their own.

Another interesting project is Objective-J - http://objective-j.org/

Being used for 280slides - http://280slides.com/

SproutCore apps have the advantage that if application bugs are discovered, or new functionality added, it only has to be fixed/installed at the server side for the end users to get the benefits. Compare that to plug-in runtimes: for example the recent press about zero-day security vulnerabilities in Flash. When Adobe eventually pull their finger out of their ass and produce a fix, how long is that going to take for the world to catch up? Many months I'll wager. Plus the global install effort in man hours wasted and the extra download bandwidth consumed will be vast. Could you even begin to put a cost on that? Server centric apps using toolkits like SproutCore are nimble, easier to maintain, and more available to end users.

..., the world capital of web development

Shows promise. When I first tried it about 4 weeks ago I found the response times poor and a lot of UI blocking going on which kills user experience. This seems to be almost 100% solved now. However, majority of the sample controls are broken on IE7 for me.

Indeed it is linked to Barry the Time Sprout.

In fact what the developers won't tell you is that it only works in Brentford and it's not been developed in the U.S. but in a shed on the allotment.

Mines the one with Brentstock Security on the back

<quote>Internet Explorer is not properly supported</quote>

You mean, IE does not properly support SproutCore or the Javascript standard correctly.

I have been using various frameworks in the past year or so and have quite some experience in it.

I don't think that SproutCore deserved all the credits it's currently getting. The only real application so far deployed on some decent scale is Apple Web Gallery (or rather .Mac), and honestly performance are lacking badly.

It's remind me a lot almost Microsoft here with how much vaporware stuff is being written when no one for sure has seen a final working app. I think that July 11 is going to show what I suspect : beautiful user interface (classic Apple) but poor performance.

Here is what I suggest when everything is available : let's check browser memory footprint and overall application response time for loading and using it... I think that until we have something to see and use, it's a lot of wasted bandwidth to claim that SproutCore is solving every problem of the web !

As mentioned in an earlier post, Cappuccino is way more oriented toward Cocoa than SproutCore !

SproutCore force you to use Ruby for your development : this is a no go for many folks.

Article states: "That is understandable, bearing in mind the quirks of IE6, yet Microsoft's obsolete browser still has a 27 per cent market share, according to the latest figures from HitsLink."

Where would we be without a company like Apple? Stuck in the past supporting IE 6.

Good riddance to IE 6!

The Register should quit towing the Microsoft line and promoting obsolete ideas.

A mix of java and cocoa would be a mocha, not a cappucino.

Nice thing it was ... until I read 'Ruby'. Straight to the trashcan.

I just don't understand Apple's aversion to Java, its exclusion from the iBone is just idiotic. And why, oh why would they go for Ruby ??? I'd rather see Obj-C on the RIA iPhone apps than the horrible Ruby thingy. And I am *not* an Obj-C fan either! (In fact, I think ObjC is kind of Smalltalk disguised as C.)

That other Objective-J sounds better than this, though ... if only because it has _no Ruby_.