the big media execs, i say, once the RIAA and MPAA are shutdown and those running it, pay for their countless crime agains humanity then maybe the court could considere shuting down The "bay".

Another simple solution:

1. Make movies available worldwide at the same time.

2. Lower the price to real market value for a movie (5$, is what some part of the world pay for a DVD)

3. Reduce cost by removing any kind of copy protection

4. Make (c) for no more then 3 to 5 years.

Here you go, problems solve.. no wait! this will force Hollywood to make a honest buck.. so this won;t happen.

Lets see if I get this right. The "legitimate" business model is that content creators get %5 and other %95 goes to anglo suits and pigopolyists whose only role is to bombard us with adverts and sue us. In addition, the legitimate media includes crippling drm restrictions such as region codes and being forced to watch adverts and a FBI warning informing us what thieves us consumers are. Whereas the pirate version are not only free but usually have the annoying drm crap removed. And they wonder why they are losing $ when they blow it on lawyer and lobbyists fees as well as offering an inferior product to "unwashed thieving masses". Wankers, the whole lot.

then next we bring charges against blockbuster, netflix, whsmith, hmv, every supermarket, and all manufacturers of blank tapes, CDs, DVDs, VCRs, DVD-writers, PCs, modems, routers, and all copper, aluminium and steel cable, and fibre-optics, for "accessory" to commit copyright infringement.

Oh and if anyone ever sold someone a dodgy copy of a movie in a council owned car park then we should sue the government too.

Electricity up 15%, food up 10%, Fuel up 25%, and a night at the flicks for me and my 2 kids means no change out of £80.

I simply cannot afford it anymore, so last weekend I ventured onto the 'Piratebay'

I have all new films now and MP3's, but would gladly pay the 'artists' in the 'Film halls' such as the odeon stopped charging close to £7 per person for one hours entertainment, with tax and NI that means you need to earn £11 p/h per person and that does not include food... A days wage to watch Golden Compass.

Pull my 'familiar' :D

what's an anglo suit?

I've heard of zoot suits and dinner suits but as far as I know, Anglo refers to either the English or a brand of bubble gum.

Of course, if it's meant to be a racial perjorative, you're no better than the people who used to make Darkie toothpaste or [removed by poster]-brown paint.

We caucasians don't want the RIAA/MPAA either.

Maybe a tenth of them are active. It looks like they keep the old unseeded torrents around just to pad their stats.

Keep it up Pirate bay ! Cost reduction for RIAA is like shooting yr own foot. How else would they sustain their cocaine lifestyles?

Would love to follow this suit and wish The Register to give it all the airing!

A matter of choice , since one only earns so much money so after deducting the cost of living and dividing the remaining few pennies left over between the computer (games and upgrades war) , home video entertainment systems insatiable appetite for the latest greatest special effects video garbage ex Hollywood , that leaves a small sum of money for perhaps one new audio CD every six months(last sales figures falls have shown the average punter has gone from two to three per week in the halcyon days to maybe one every six months )!

Now given that 98% of the new music released weekly is of the variety hear once it sounds like "some one is whipping the dog or cat both literally and figuratively" and then you wish you never hear it again variety ! How indeed else but by the use of p2p to sample and sort through the dross to find the rarer better quality one in six months you can afford from amongst the crap and dross the big three release in a never ending stream(looks like EMI is for sale again shortly) It of course does not help but two years on you find the very same CD in the $2-00 bargain basement bin though after spending top dollar previously !

Although I think my ears are getting old and tired when Mozart , Hayden and Beethoven start to sound far better then the latest Billboard top 100 of suck and throw away tunes and the eyes start to roll at the mere thought of watching MTV's latest round of soft porn used to flog the tune of the month though ?

What price a choice indeed ? , but if they continue to release that which sucks often , little wonder people seek alternatives like "the bay" to spend their money more wisely !

Go ask Paris she would probably be able to tell them why turkeys can't fly all that well !

" next we bring charges against blockbuster, netflix, whsmith, hmv, every supermarket, and all manufacturers of blank tapes, CDs, DVDs, VCRs, DVD-writers, PCs, modems, routers, and all copper, aluminium and steel cable, and fibre-optics, for "accessory" to commit copyright infringement. "

We've been fighting off the threat of a generic copyright-tax on blank media for years now, and there have been occasional suggestions to extend it to PCs themselves. So careful what you go suggesting, because we might get it - but not in a way that we'd want.

Why do they bother trying to take these places down? After Demonoid decided to call it day, the load merely shifted to other sites and the number of torrents went up on TPB, BT and Mininova. As usual the "suits" wasting time, effort and someone else's money on a pointless cause, the only real winners are the legal-eagles coining it in while on £250/hour charges!

I often wonder if the world would be a better place without so called "Intellectual Property." I have come of the opinion that the very idea that you can own something intellectual is grossly offensive and not one argument for IP stands up to even the most cursory level of scrutiny...

... yet, in a world of Billions of people, we keep the the crazy idea that you can own something "Intellectual."

Utter nonsense.

I find more amusing is that people actually want to watch the drivel that is produced by Hollywood nowadays... I'm sick and tired of the Tom and Jerry approach to all films produced where the good guy wins (cue floaty music) all kids survive (and perhaps have a hand in or solve) the destruction of Earth or similar.

Balls to them.

It's about time they produced a movie whereby nice guys died, kids get killed and the dodgy bloke with the bat gets off scott free.

Films like that would never make a dime in HAmerica however as they are devoid of reality and thought... they prefer to leave the Cinema happy and knowing good triumphs over evil, at least until they get carjacked on the way out.

Go RIAA! Go MPAA! Close them down!

Quite a few somewhat controversial movies are in cinemas these days (Rendition, American Gangster, Juno, The Kingdom) - so perhaps you should not cram the entire industry into a box that only fits the Adam Sandler genre.

That said, I agree completely that this is a lost fight. As stated by Dan Glickman (Chairman, MPAA) in "Steal This Movie II", they realize they will never stop piracy - they just "have to try to make it as difficult and tedious as possible". The first question that pops into my head is whether they really and honestly believe creating the greatest PR possible for sites like the bay is effective in achieving this goal. To my knowledge, stunts like this hasn't exactly worked in their favor in the past.

Before the industry understands one simple truth about the modern tech, they will lose: It is not the free products PtP networks offer to the consumers, it is the easy access that draws the crowd.

Average consumer for the music-industry doesn't have CD-player. Or even a credit card as he is only 14!

What he does have, is computer, a music phone with mp3- player and Nintendo Wii under TV in the living room. And instead of trying to sell this potential customer their products, both movie and music industry make damn sure he doesn't have it.

Imagine this kid with a friend in his room.

Watch a movie? Downloading it from some legal site demands a credit card. His only DVD-player is in his computer and copy protection sees he doesn't want to rent a movie either.

Listen some music? Same thing. Furthermore he would want to listen it also on his way to school and the CD format doesn't allow him to upload it on his phone. Nice sales pitch for the record industry.

Of course he will download them! Even few hand-cam recorded new realeses on overnight download from New Zealand are easier to deal, than the hoops movie industry would like their 'customer' to jump for them for product with all kinds of strings attached!

Simply put, record and movie industries are both stuck so badly into 1920's that they make LPs look modern. They really need few fresh ideas, if they want to survive.

"then next we bring charges against blockbuster, netflix, whsmith, hmv, every supermarket, and all manufacturers of blank tapes, CDs, DVDs, VCRs, DVD-writers, PCs, modems, routers, and all copper, aluminium and steel cable, and fibre-optics, for "accessory" to commit copyright infringement".

This already happens in The Netherlands, where if you buy blank CDs, you also pay a tax to cover potential copyright loss. I am one of those folk who still buys CDs (though usually not at premium rate, unless I know the CD is not crammed with fillers), and all blank CDs I buy are meant to store data, not music/movies, etc. Yet, I have to pay this crap tax. Oh, and buying in Germany or abroad is hardly an option. If the customs catch you, you're f*cked.

The same was attempted on MP3 players, but thankfully someone in the government had some sanity left. By the reasoning of these shady copyright-claiming agencies (who somehow are unable to show exactly how the copyright holders are compensated, but do manage to be seated in exquisite buildings), they ought to lock me up, as potentially I could drive my car while drunk and hit someone. No matter if I don't drink and drive, others do, so I should be punished for it, too.

Paris Hilton cause she could have thought up that logic, too.

Not everyone can or wants to build tangible things to earn a living. Why is it fair to buy a loaf of bread from a baker but not pay an artist for a song? By your argument programmers don't have a right to a living from the software they write either. Why not? Your argument against IP only makes sense in two places: Karl Marx's dream or a society without money. Since neither scenario exists or is likely to ever happen, we have to find some way of allowing our artists to buy bread and software.

No doubt in your utopian dream good artists would rise through some sort of crowded meritocracy, but how will the really talented ones (who are usually useless at any other form of paid work) ever make it through the early days? There has to be some glimmer of the hope of earnings at some point or nobody would ever commit to a career in music. Everyone has to eat. Hence, protected rights for artists to exploit their work for roughly a lifetime.

I bet that your issue is more with corporate ownership of IP rather than the concept of copyright itself.

Cursorily scrutinize away.

So by their reasoning as I *can* use Google to find obscure torrents that would make Google culpable as it provides a service for my *crime*? Gotta love such generic reasoning...

" next we bring charges against blockbuster, netflix, whsmith, hmv, every supermarket, and all manufacturers of blank tapes, CDs, DVDs, VCRs, DVD-writers, PCs, modems, routers, and all copper, aluminium and steel cable, and fibre-optics, for "accessory" to commit copyright infringement. "

However much I like the torrent sites, and however desirable an efficient economy of knowledge and culture is (efficient economy as defined by the last three centuries of economic science, that is "price is equal to marginal cost"), unfortunately, PirateBay are stupid brats who do everything they can to ensure their task is as hard as it can be.

The difference between the above and PirateBay is that Netflix and WHSmith do not put up on their website and on every interview you can get the fact that they want people to do illegal things, and that they're very happy to be the main provider of the possibility of doing such illegal things.

One couldn't be more stupid as people from the PirateBay.

They keep telling the world to go fuck off and they'll help people pirate goods because they like it and they are against the law and want everyone to be able to break it.

How stupid...

Even if they don't host a file on their server, it's illegal about everywhere in the world to do something with the clear aim of allowing someone to commit a felonny/crime.

And here they go about bragging about it.

At the very least, they should say "I'm not doing anything illegal, I'm sorry if my users do, I don't like it a bit. Sure, I don't really like the laws and am campaining to change them, but in the meantime, I'm completely law-abiding and disapprove totally of any illegal use that is made of my service."

They could then even add "here, see, I'm fighting piracy, I put up a notice on the first page of the site saying 'don't be a pirate, that's all wrong and hurts loooots of good, nice people".

And then they would go on making sure everyone gets access to all movies in the world for free.

By bragging about helping people doing illegal things, they're basically acting as spoiled teenagers who needs to shout at the world that they won't abide by the rules. When you're a responsible grown-up, you don't abide by the rules if you don't like them, but you do your best to ensure you do it in a way that lets you go on, instead of inviting the whole world to a show where you breach the law in public in front of hundreds of policemen while yelling "I fuck you" at them.

Still, good luck to them, though I wish they'd make their own luck and try to act responsibly, for once. ('responsibility' as in 'doing what it takes to fuck the system' instead of ensuring said system will catch them)

It doesn't matter which way you spin this, Pirate Bay clearly facilitate criminal acts. It's theft from the people who are involved at every stage of the chain. Like it or not what the record and film industry does is perfectly legal unless we're playing fantasy law-school again in which vacuous moral statements are trumpeted as being cast-iron interpretations of law.

The messages from this board are both irreconcilable and dishonest; people whine like little children about the cost of living, about how it costs a day's wages to see the Golden Compass yet at the same time mainstream entertainment is shit, not worth paying for (presumably at any price?) yet apparently worth downloading. How do you square the circle in downloading material you've already described as utter rubbish and not worth paying for?

The truth is, the inconsistent and fundamentally disingenuous people who write this nonsense have absolutely no intention of paying for entrainment at any price; the "I would gladly pay..." statement is dishonest piss of the very highest order, because we all know you would gladly pay nothing.

PS: The cost of living plea is quite a new one from people reading too many tabloid papers, this isn't the 1970s; in 50 years the price of living has halved in almost all areas other than housing and transport. Only 3% of our income goes into fuel compared to 6% in 1957, food has went from 33% to 15%. Our basic necessities have never been cheaper. People making out like this is the Winter of Discontent and screaming they're being paralysed by price increases that haven't actually arrived yet show just how flawed the entire premise is. A lot of selfish little children that want everything for nothing. May be it's time you moved out of your parents' house and started to grow up. Your something for nothing philosophy is more embarrassing than even the worst welfare-scrounging diatribe from the Daily Mail.

Apologists for rampant individualism, selfishness and greed just won't do. You're no better than the RIAA or MPAA, if anything you're worst. If you want to pursue social justice try starting with homelessness or hunger, I think "Action for Free Music because I don't want to pay for it" hardly has much of a ring to it.

The only people who win are lawyers.

The recording industry pay them. Every now and again they catch someone. For every one they catch another two spring up.

Every time someone invents an advancement in DRM someone somewhere cracks it in a week.

Who really cares who is suing who?

If every single one of the Piratebay users donated £1 to their legal fund it would pay decent lawyers enough to drag this on for years. When someone wins we all donate to the next big tracker and so on.

The recording industry should cut out the lawyers and embrace the internet as Radiohead have done.

If this back street industry was legalised and everyone paid £5 per month for endless consumption you would have at least 50million peers, it would work fantastically fast and the industry would have a revenue stream of £250million a month or £3billion a year to share out.

They are either too thick or too greedy to figure this out though.

'mon the Bay!

I object to your suggestion that the good guy always wins in Tom and Jerry. In plenty of episodes, Jerry gets a final comeuppance that somewhat balances the indignities suffered by Tom. As early as "'Fraidy cat, " (number four) the final laugh is on Jerry.

I'll get me coat.

"and also leads to, making copyright protected material available"

Of course. Isn't all content 'copyright protected'? My home movies are copyright protected. Even if I choose to share them with the world via PirateBay, the copyright is still mine. Or does this guy think that copyright law now only resides with the big labels?

I'd suggest actually that artists keep themselves afloat in the early days through playing at pubs and clubs, especially since they don't see any money for an album until they're signed, and even then they don't make much. Look at what happened to TLC, due to tax, and bad contracts, they got completely screwed. While, yes, illegal sharing is stealing, it seems quite clear to me that not EVERY download is a lost sale, therefore only the seeders should be liable for breaking copyright, that the record companies make EXPONENTIALLY more than the artists on sales, and that the majority of artists' money comes from gigs, even after they are signed. Record companies are NOT needed for promotion, the Arctics prove that, production of media, yes, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's not long that a small media producer starts up which offers artists FAIR wages and starts doing well.

Watching programs about celebrity cribs, boasting huge plasma tvs in every room, and flash cars for every day of the week, not to mention obscene amounts of bling, its difficult to feel any sympathy for someone like who thinks they might have had some of their copyrighted material downloaded for free.

Ok I have to admit that I have used pirate bay, AND because of it I actually buy more music. I have discovered so many new bands because of this. I of course want to support the bands I like, and so that's why I'm more than happy to part with cash for the legal version of an album once I've found something I really like. If it wasn't for this site, the music industry wouldn't get half as much of my money as they do now.

Record labels shouldn't look to ban these sites, but more how they can work with them.

Nicelly put, except for 2 aweful flaws in your logic:

1) You mixed it all as if the same person used all the arguments you mentioned. For example, "if you wouldn't watch because it's shite, why do you download" argument holds zero weight. We don't download the crap. Well, I don't. See the problem with generalizations? You killed every chance of having this commenter here to take yours seryously. Not to say that I am not a pirate, I am. But I download only what I can't get legally anyway. You see, the problem is that I live in South America and happen to love some tv series that will never show around here. Not without paying 400% import rates anyway on DVDs, thats a steal way bigger than piracy. Imagine yourself paying 25ish Big Macs (the universal coin) on 3 DVDs. Last ones that I watched were Life on Mars and this week I am watching Pushing Daisies. Top stuff. Last sunday also I went to see Juno at the theather, and I really recommend it, it is fun and has some witty dialogues.

2) Laws. They are *making* the laws as they go. It is called lobby and corruption. Prime example that comes to mind is the bill they are trying to pass in the US about making it legal for "Copyright holders" to hack in any computer to look for offending copies, or that other nutter in the UK threating to "legislate" a way for the ISPs to become responsable for p2p trafic not inflinging copyrights.

These pieces of legislation aren't laws, they are pure and distiled greed shoved up your arses and down your throats. And you sanction then whenever you write "It is the LAW. Obey it".

You go ahead and do it, sheep. I am happy at least some are challeging the status quo, and will donate to their defend fund if it comes to this. They will lose, of course, for the game is rigged, but I wont think it was a waste.

You come across as the big clever man but really you need to read more about the Swedish law. The P-Bay are just telling people where to download copyrighted material they are not providing it.

In Sweden this is not ilegal.